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(upbeat music) Nothing is more expensive than bad information. Know the source, oneradionetwork.com. - Okay, here we are back with part two of our little show here as we're live. December 17th, 2019, Patrick Timpone, oneradionetwork.com. On the third Tuesday of each month, we're honored to have Dr. Ray Peat, PhD, University of Oregon. He's specialization in physiology. Started his work on hormones in '68, 1968. That's the year I started in radio, Dr. Peat. We started together, oh. And his dissertation in '72 where he was on hormones, and he's been working in this field ever since.
He's taught university level, and he writes so many different articles. His website's very popular, and he does a little newsletter we'll tell you about. And Dr. Ray Peat is up, and you're in Washington, right, Doc? - Oregon. - Oh, you're in Oregon, in Oregon. You're near Portlandia? - No, Eugene. - Eugene, is that more towards the coast, or are you more eastern? - About 60 miles from the coast, and 100 miles south of Portland. - Ah, uh-huh. Do you have nice weather? Like, what are your winters like up there? - Oh, some snow.
We've had up to four feet of snow, but some winters, no snow at all. - Uh-huh, yeah. And how are you doing, how's your life? - Oh, very good. Weather's cold right now. - Yeah, uh-huh. You do quite a bit of research, ongoing, right? And you paint as well. - Yep. - Yeah. You doing any particular research right now? - Yeah, the last few weeks, I've been particularly interested in why the lifespan is decreasing. Life expectancy is decreasing now in the US, and the government is finally admitting it. That, on top of the rapid increase
in autoimmune disease, degenerative disease, and the cancer rate and mortality increasing in younger people, I've been looking for explanations for that. - So the autoimmune thing, when did that really start? Was it about 15, 20, or 15 years ago? People used to start talking about the autoimmune-- - Yeah, 50 years ago was pretty rare. - Yeah. Is the basic principle that we've heard over the years that there's, let's see if I understand what I've heard about it, and tell me if this is close, where the body gets like an infection,
a virus, a bacteria, or a fungus, and the body is trying to get after that, the immune system, and it actually attacks its own tissues? Is that the classic-- - That's the classic standard story. - Is that correct? - I don't think so. - Oh, good, see, I didn't think so. (laughing) - For example, studies in animals trying to duplicate that process, they give them a viral infection of the brain that increases the antibodies, just like in multiple sclerosis and the other human diseases, and they find that if they prevent those so-called autoantibodies,
if they block the cells that produce those autoantibodies, the animal dies, that the autoantibodies are actually there repairing tissues, and I've seen this in people with very high autothyroid antibodies. That's a pretty common thing now to have chronic inflammation of the thyroid gland with high antibodies, but just very high thyroid-stimulating hormone causes inflammation of the gland, and the immune system is attempting to clean up the way it does in the virus infection of the brain in animals. The immune system needs those antibodies as part of a tissue cleanup process, and actually, our immune system,
if you go way back to the Nobel Prizes in immunity with Ehrlich and Metchnikoff, who shared the Nobel Prize, I think it was 1908 or '10, Ehrlich worked for the chemical drug industry and created the antibody theory of immunity. Metchnikoff was an embryologist, and he saw the immune system as a process of maintaining the structure of the body, removing damaged tissues so that the body remained entire and healthy, and you can see that process happening in the thyroid, or if you just injure a cartilage, for example, your body will produce autoimmune antibodies,
but it's a process of removing damaged tissue so that the cartilage will be restored. - So the body's doing what it's supposed to do. This is the body's way of protecting the thyroid or cleaning it up after this high TSH level causes inflammation? - Yeah, preservation and restoration. - Preservation, restoration. But now, as I understand it, they're all doing antibody tests for thyroid, and if they see the antibodies, they don't, even the natural community, they're treating the antibody thyroid issue differently, right, if it's autoimmune thyroid, they call it, then they're treating it differently,
but you're saying they're incorrect. - There are some really terrible drugs that they put people on chronically to basically suppress or kill the cells that are creating those antibodies. Now, for about 50 years, it's been very clear, especially with animal research, that estrogen is an extremely powerful factor in disrupting the immune system, creating inflammation. Women have several times the incidence of autoimmune diseases, possibly even 10 times as much thyroid inflammatory disease as men, and that's because estrogen is suppressing the restorative part of the immune system and activating the inflammatory part.
- So what's going on now, if you go to a natural naturopath or anybody, or a natural doc, or even a regular conventional doc, and they give you the whole thyroid panel, lots of them, if they're a little bit more educated, they'll wanna do an antibodies to see if it's an autoimmune issue, right? So you're saying the research really shows that that's what the body's supposed to do, and you would just leave that alone if you were giving medical advice, which you don't do? - No, over the last 40 years, I guess,
I've seen probably 20 or 30 women with that condition, probably much, much more than that, but if their doctor will give them a full replacement dose of thyroid hormone, glandular thyroid, over a period of five or six months, those antibodies fade away. - They fade away. That would be a nature, or what's the correct term now? Is it nature thyroid, or just where it's got everything, the T4s, the T3s, and everything? - Desiccated thyroid. - Desiccated thyroid. - That's a traditional, or thyroid USP, was the standard term.
In just the last few weeks, I've run across two women who, during their pregnancy, went to the doctor just for a checkup, and against their preference, they were given a vaccination, one of the compound multiple vaccines, and almost immediately, their blood pressure went up, their blood sugar went up, they were diagnosed as having preeclampsia and gestational diabetes, and both of the first one was sure that the vaccination had rather done, and so she kept alert, watching what was happening. She developed rheumatoid arthritis symptoms, went back for thorough exams,
and found she had the lupus typical antibody, so she was diagnosed with SLE lupus, and they wanted to put her on the immune system killing drugs, but she was, by that time, very skeptical about their judgment, and so she started taking thyroid and progesterone and changing her diet, and the arthritis faded away, the lupus antibodies faded away. I think in probably any case of autoimmune antibodies, if you remove the problem, the sources of inflammation, the antibodies after about six or eight months will fade away. - So this autoimmune model, it's always creating antibodies
to try to repair the particular organ, whether it be pancreas or stomach or anything with H. pylori, and you can see H. pylori antibodies, the body's doing what it's supposed to do. - Yeah, the antibody is like, some people have described it as butter on the food you're going to eat, it makes it more appetizing for the white blood cells to eat whatever the antibody sticks to. So sometimes it's a germ, but very often it's the broken down tissue, one's own tissue that's damaged has to be cleaned up and removed.
- Is there any case in the literature or the research showing where the immune system is actually harming the body or attacking the body, like we've been told that arthritis is where the immune system is attacking the joints and the knees and stuff? - Yeah, there are hundreds and hundreds of papers supposedly demonstrating that by experiments, but there are also hundreds of examples of those people who almost overnight, in a few cases, literally overnight recovered from those so-called autoimmune diseases. - Because the body took care of the infection that was the original cause?
- Or the hormone deficiency that was leading to the inflammation instead of just a quiet cleanup process. - Kind of lost you there. - If the white blood cells are slightly poisoned by a bad diet and your thyroid hormone doesn't provide the energy, then there tends to be quite a bit of lactic acid in circulation, and maybe only 50% above average, but that's enough to start the inflammation process. And so just by increasing the energy production, you lower the lactic acid and reduce the basis of the inflammation. And with the lactic acid removed,
then the oxidative metabolism can get going, energize the process of cleanup. - And what are some of the causes of the high lactic acids? - Probably the basic general cause is anything that shifts you over to having free fatty acids circulating in your blood. Any kind of stress that runs into a limitation of energy capacity will break down the fatty acids in your tissues, put them into your bloodstream as a source of energy which can keep the organism running for weeks, eating its own tissues. But when the fatty acids are being circulated,
they block the ability to oxidize glucose. And when you aren't oxidizing glucose, you aren't producing as much lactic acid, and you aren't producing as much carbon dioxide and carbonic acid. And that lack of carbonic acid inside the cell allows the cell to shift over to the production of lactic acid. The healthy cell is oxidizing glucose which produces a lot more carbon dioxide than oxidizing fat does. And that higher carbon dioxide suppresses the process of glycolysis and making lactic acid. - That was a little geeky for me, complicated.
But so in more simple terms of dietary things, what do we do unknowingly to increase this lactic acid or to improve it with the foods? - You need all of the trace minerals and essential vitamins and adequate protein. And then ideally you would get all of your energy from carbohydrates, sugar or starches, and not have to rely on burning fat because stress turns on the fat burning. And that turns on almost always some background lactic acid formation. - Oh, there goes the old keto thing. I mean, isn't that the whole pitch on ketosis
where you're burning fat? - Yeah, and for example, when the brain is given ketones, or especially the short or middle medium chain triglycerides, when you are making an argument by doing a particular set of experiments, you take a frame of reference and you can seem to have made your point within a certain context. But for example, if you're advocating the ketone-based brain energy, you shift your argument over to make lactic acid a virtue rather than a menace. And the medium chain triglycerides, for example, are oxidized by the astrocytes, the connective tissue of the brain.
It causes them to produce a lot of lactic acid. And so if you see lactic acid as a virtue for energy, then that seems to support the fat diet. - Oh, it's kind of with many things on planet Earth, whether it is, I don't know, just all kinds of things why it's not legal to pay taxes or something. When you cherry pick information and bring out to prove your point, you can prove your point, but you're not saying looking at the whole thing, it's a more reductionist way of looking at it?
- Yeah, narrowing the frame, if you can control the frame, the universe of reference of your discussion, the frame will determine the outcome. But if you look at a broader picture, for example, a lot of disagreement currently is on the meaning of lactic acid. And there is a whole line of publication going on saying that lactic acid is the greatest stuff in the world. It feeds the brain and makes you athletic and so on. But really, it's the background shift towards lactic acid metabolism is the essence of stress, inflammation, and degeneration.
- And so it's really key when you're looking at the lactic acid production and with the muscle of the heart, for example, too, isn't it? - Oh, yeah. - It's a big deal, yeah. - Yeah, I think there should be a regular test of lactic acid content in the blood. You could see oncoming heart disease and cancer much earlier. - And so the big producers of lactic acid, stress, too much-- - And fats. Too much fat in your diet. - Too much fat, even that good old grass-fed whatever, animal fat?
- Yeah, too much fat. - Too much butter, too? Too much butter? - Yeah, you could eat so much butter that it can have that effect even though it's good fat. - Pretty good. So how is butter different from, say, oh, I don't know. - Fish oil, for example. - Yeah, well, fish oil, yeah. - It's the most extreme. When you eat butter, the highly saturated fats, uric acid, for example, it has an anti-inflammatory effect in most tissues and doesn't, it has an antioxidant action because it is so stable.
Fish oil and safflower oil, soy oil, have so much highly unsaturated fat that they are spontaneously oxidizing even before it reaches your bloodstream. - Wow. - Fish fat. - They oxidize. - Oxidizing. And it's the oxidized fat molecules, in the case of fish oil, that will temporarily produce an anti-inflammatory effect by poisoning your immune system. - What about if you were getting fat from, say, I don't know, well-tended pigs or something, that other kind of saturated fat? - Yeah, if the pigs-- - Is that okay? If the pigs are all healthy and cool?
- Yeah, if they were eating-- - Good stuff. - Foy and apples, for example, their fat would be just like butter. - Interesting, we have a farmer's market here in Dripping Springs, and they have these big pictures, and these folks have these pigs on a vegetarian diet, and they must know something about what you've just said. - Yeah, in Mexico, lots of pigs are fed basically a fruit. - Yeah. - Very interesting. But did I hear you say that the energy from more of the sugars and the carbs are preferable?
Is it preferable, actually, over meat in general? - Well, meat should provide the protein, which is essential, and lots of the vitamins and minerals. But meat has a very high content of phosphate, and almost no calcium in proportion. - Right. - And phosphate imitates the stress condition. When you're under stress and break down ATP, you liberate phosphate, which activates tissue, and is part of the muscle contraction and excitation. But if you don't eat enough calcium in proportion, you start having an average condition of overexcitation. - So you can do too much, let's say,
say too much meat and not enough dark greens with calcium or whatever. - Yeah, the cooked greens are the richest source of calcium, and so cows eat mostly greens when they can. And so the milk is a very good source of magnesium and calcium from the greens they eat. - People wonder why, like you, you drink milk, and other folks are drinking good milk, that the calcium doesn't end up in the wrong spot, like in the arteries. - Yeah, it's the phosphate excess that pushes the calcium into your arteries and out of the bones.
And that's very closely related to the problem of inflammation, degeneration, and immune failure. The phosphate out of proportion triggers your parathyroid gland, and the parathyroid hormone specializes in moving calcium out of your bones, bringing it into the blood to balance the phosphate. But the parathyroid hormone does that, mobilizes calcium out of the bone by blocking oxidative metabolism, creating local lactic acid production, which breaks down the bone. And that happens anywhere in the body that is exposed to parathyroid hormone. So it's one of the emergency hormones, which is, if it's turned on chronically
by eating a high phosphate intake, that becomes a chronic block to your energy production, shifts you to the generalized lactic acid formation. And in your soft tissues, that dominance of lactic acid in the presence of phosphate de-energizes the tissue, and allows the formation, starting right in your mitochondria, the calcium phosphate crystals form as the mitochondrion dies. And the lactic acid production has shifted the pH of the cell so that the crystal calcium phosphate is insoluble as long as you're producing lactic acid under the influence of parathyroid hormone.
The calcium crystals become insoluble in your soft tissues, but are broken down, taking the calcium out of your bone. - And what would be the metric on a blood test to connect up a high parathyroid hormone circulating in the body to cause this issue? Would it be a high TSH level? - Yeah, that and aldosterone is part of it. The angiotensin system is a big part of it. They all go with parathyroid hormone, but the common blood test, the most often identified feature is a low vitamin D content in the blood,
because vitamin D helps to shift the ratio in your body towards calcium, away from phosphate. And the vitamin D or a high calcium intake turns off the parathyroid hormone. - Which is good, right? Which is good to turn, yeah. - And so eating lots of calcium surprises a lot of people, will prevent calcification of the soft tissues. - It's crazy, yeah. So the vitamin D, is it the same as taking a vitamin D supplement or being out in the sun? - Better to be in the sun. - The sun? - And eventually when your tissues
have assimilated the calcium and vitamin D, you actually become resistant to the sun, because it's the de-energized tissues liberating fatty acids and such that make you sunburn and age your skin in the sun. In rabbit experiments many years ago, they fed one batch of rabbits corn oil, the other some more saturated fat, and they shaved them and exposed them to sunlight. The rabbits that ate the good diet didn't get wrinkly skin or sunburn. The ones on the corn oil diet got prematurely aged skin. - Very interesting.
Dr. Ray Peat is with us, we have lots of emails we're gonna get to, [email protected]. I got an email from somebody and they were trying to make the argument that sugar, that you don't seem to be too concerned about, I mean, let's see how they're saying this, it's a long email, I just tried to condense it a bit just to put up their argument forward and see what you think, where high, let's see, with sugar the HGH level goes down so that ages the body, the insulin level goes up
with sugar so that lowers HGH, the cortisol goes up which causes aging, sugar raises insulin too much, the glycation, so making the argument that insulin in the system is causing aging in the body. - Well, lowering human growth hormone is one of the great advantages of carbohydrate, sugar or starch. - That's good? - Yeah, because the growth hormone is one of the stress-related hormones, it rises when your blood sugar is low and liberates free fatty acids tending towards diabetes. If you give an excess of growth hormone it imitates most of the degenerative features of diabetes.
- So-- - And animals that spontaneously lack the growth hormone live about twice as long as ones with the normal growth hormone. - So high HGH levels are not pro-youthing at all, they're just the opposite. - Pro-aging, pro-diabetes. - Wow, man, how can-- - Experimenters have removed animals' pituitary glands and replaced the, I think they gave cortisol in moderation and thyroid hormone, but didn't replace growth hormone or luteinizing hormone or ACTH, supposedly essential. And the animals lived twice as long or more, just like the ones who, by mutation, naturally lack the growth hormone.
- This classic meme called, what is it, metabolic syndrome, where if you eat too many carbs and insulin levels and then that can cause inflammation in the arteries. - Yeah, that's basically caused by eating too much fat. Not enough-- - Eating too much fat. - Not enough carbohydrate. - Not enough, so the metabolic syndrome model is incorrect in your opinion, in the research. - You can create it very quickly by especially polyunsaturated fat. - Yeah, the PUFAs. - Yeah. - But when you say eating too much fat,
even all the good fats or just the bad fats, just the fish oils and those kind of things? - Butter and coconut oil, for example, have about 3% of the bad fats, the PUFA. And so even though the stearic and palmitic acids are, in some way, they can be protective, but chronically, you're going to accumulate and store these PUFA because you preferentially oxidize the saturated fats. They're safer, don't destroy the mitochondria as quickly. So you store and build these PUFA into your tissues. If you look at a newborn calf or baby,
the brain of either is almost perfectly free of polyunsaturated fats. But in the human, very quickly, by the time they're 10 or 12 years old, the brain is already showing high accumulation of PUFA. And the metabolism, meanwhile, is slowing drastically. And after the age of 12, up until about 20, when the growth slows down or stops, the tissues are loading up more and more with PUFA. And after the age of 20, when there's no dilution by growth, the concentration of PUFA increases steadily for the rest of your life because they are preferentially
stored and built into your tissues, including your brain tissue, rather than being oxidized. And they tie up the cholesterol, which is synthesized in the brain as part of a normal brain physiology. But the PUFA bound to the cholesterol makes it insoluble. And so it's like ashes or clickers building up in your brain throughout the lifespan, primarily because of the accumulation of unmetabolized PUFA. - And what are some of the more popular and prolific PUFAs out there that we would know? - Fish oil. - Fish oil. - Safflower and cottonseed and--
- Corn oil, soy oil, that kind of stuff. - All of the things which make good paint and varnish. - Paint and varnish, yeah. So when you say bad fats, you're really referring to PUFAs. - Yeah. - Yeah, uh-huh. - Hmm. Oh, man. So here's one for you. Quite interested in Ray Peat's consumption of milk. And it seems, I've been trying, it says, "Dolly," she's in Seattle up near you, "I just can't seem to drink even raw grass-fed milk "and not get constipated. "Does that mean that I just don't need this
"or could something else be going on?" - What the cow eats shows up in the milk. A mother who is breastfeeding often will eat peanuts or tomatoes or something and find that the baby gets diarrhea and rashes. It's the same with the cows. If the cow is fed something, could be weeds in the pasture, something that you're sensitive to, then it will cause inflammation just like the baby that gets diarrhea. - Wow, so how, man, so you would, how would you do that? Would you just have to try to find a source
that doesn't make you constipated? - Yeah, I've known people who tried five or six different brands. Sometimes they will settle on something which isn't really very tasty, ultra-pasteurized milk, basically cooked until it's sterile. (both laughing) - Just they cook the life out of it, but do you still get the same, similar benefits, though? - Yeah, lots of people find that they can tolerate that without constipation or diarrhea or asthma symptoms. - So even, so when they say grass-fed cows and say you rely on the source, you don't really know where they've been.
I mean, they could be eating something, a patch of something that could make you constipated. - There is one famous organic milk source. I've heard half a dozen other people had the same reaction. I tried it several times and got sick each time. Several people have told me the same experience with that organic company. But I've tried three or four other organic milks. One of them tasted especially awful. And I looked up where their farm was, organic certified, but it was downwind from a very stinky, horrible factory. - Oh, good.
- And the air the cows were breathing, possibly something was settling on the grass that they didn't detect in their organic certification. But I think probably just cows breathing that stinky air were contaminating the milk. - My goodness. It's easy to see then how so many people have different experiences with milk. - Yeah, I think the good taste of the milk should be the most reliable guide. The one I use most often is Safeway's Lucerne milk. - Here's an email for you. Considering that one was following Dr. Peat's information in living a healthy as possible,
according to some of his research and information, how long does he think one is expected to live a healthy life? Also, how much damage can be undone if living unhealthy for say several decades? Is there damage that is irreversible, such as if one starts late in life with decades of unhealthy living? Does this affect their lifespan if they begin living more healthy? That's a great question. - Yeah, just taking the PUFA into account, your blood vessels and your brain, for example, deteriorate in proportion to the amount of the polyunsaturated esters of cholesterol.
Those become hard to excrete and build up and inactivate the cells. But I've looked for things that can shift the balance towards de-esterification to help the system to break down and liberate the free cholesterol from the polyunsaturated fat. And estrogen makes the balance worse and progesterone tends to help the balance. And I don't know of any prolonged experiments in which they've tried to reverse an animal's aged brain by giving them a high balance of progesterone. But you can see improvement in many of the tissues, possibly because of the anti-inflammatory effects of the progesterone.
But I think prolonged dominance of progesterone tends to reverse those brain and blood vessel changes. - So, but to your points about the body repairing, over time the body will repair bad activity? - Yeah, that's part of the function of the immune system. - That's what it does. - Is to break down the damaged tissue and let new cells form. - Do you have any theories, or if you had to pick a number, if you were on a game show, about what lifespan humans these days,
I know you're studying now how the lifespan is going down, how long we should be able to hang around and be healthy? - The official view, since the authorities themselves aren't likely to live more than 70 or 80 years, they won't accept evidence of anyone outliving them, basically, so since the French woman, I forget her, Jeanette, lived to be 122, and she was on TV reminiscing about meeting Vincent Van Gogh, people now accept 122 as the maximum. But over my lifetime, I've seen examples, like when I was in Florida, a local newspaper
reported on a man who had been picking oranges since he was a middle-aged man. He went on Social Security in the 1930s, and so according to the documentation, at that time he was 135, but the story just didn't get under the general wire services. And when I was in high school, a lot of newspapers reported a little tiny guy from Peru, who, according to the best documentation, church records were very well kept. He was 184 when he came to the United States. And in England in the 1800s, there was Old Parr, who,
just a regular old guy living in the country, but he had remarried when he was around 100 and outlived, I guess, two or three wives. But his documentation showed him to be, I think it was 152. He was taken to visit the king, had some fine dining, which he wasn't accustomed to, and died. And so they had the chance to autopsy him. And the best physician in England at the time did a thorough autopsy and couldn't find any cause of death, nothing wrong with any of his tissues. - My goodness.
If you just hypothetically had to move to an island and you could only take three or four foods with you 'cause you had nothing on this island, this is just a fantasy movie that is not gonna happen, but just for fun, I wanted to ask you, what foods would you take with you if you only, say, take three foods? Dr. Peat, you can only have three foods. What would you take? - Cheese, tortillas, and oranges. (laughing) - I like it, it's a good, cheese, turkeys, and oranges, really. - Yeah, yeah, cheese tacos and orange juice.
- Turkeys are fairly neutral food for some reason that people tend to do fairly well on, and we don't eat all that much, do we, turkey? - Which, which is? - Turkey, turkey. - Turkey? - Yeah. - Like chicken, they tend to feed them lots of grains, and so their fat is very unsaturated. So, I think if you eat the leanest parts, like the breast meat, that's pretty good food. - But when you say unsaturated, saturated's the best, right? 'Cause that's more stable, right, okay. Yeah, yeah.
So, I don't even know what turkeys eat out in the wild. We have turkeys out here where I live, who live in the-- - Well, if they're wild-- - What do they eat? - If they're wild turkeys, they're probably eating lots of bugs and worms. - That's what-- - So, it would be better. - Same way with the chickens, right? If you can get some real chickens that are hanging out all day, that's where the best eggs, the best eggs are. - Yeah, I had a friend who, every day,
chopped up the leavings, leftovers from the kitchen, lots of tortillas, and chopped up vegetables and such, and the eggs were very good. - Yeah, Cynthia wants to know if Dr. Peat ever eats bread. Have you ever been married? Do you have any children? If so, do they follow your work? So, you don't have to answer that second part if you don't want to. For the first one, do you eat bread at all? - No to all of them. - No to all of them, just no to all of them. Why not bread?
- Well, I, 45 years ago, liked to make bread. - Yeah. - I would soak it, about 12 hours, keeping the flour wet so that the enzymes would break it down. It doesn't have to be literally sourdough, but the long soaking period increases the protein and decreases, or practically eliminates the gluten. And I found that that was very digestible, very tasty. I could eat a loaf of bread at bedtime and sleep very well. Or a slice of regular bread would disturb my sleep. - 'Cause of the gluten? 'Cause of the gluten, do you think?
- I think so. - Mm-hmm, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know if I've ever asked you, what do you, we probably have and I just don't recall, but what do you make of all this gluten sensitivity? And you have whole aisles now dedicated to gluten-free this and gluten-free that at the store. Does the literature show exactly why this is going on? Research, do we know? - Yeah, gluten has a string of amino acids with the same pattern that estrogen activates in the intestine. And like estrogen, it can activate inflammation
just by that pattern that the immune system recognizes, sort of a signal of stress. - Gluten can do that. But why have people eaten bread through history? I mean, bread-- - Oh, through history, they would do it in the traditional way of letting it soak hours and hours. Or in much of Asia and the Western Hemisphere, they used ashes. They would add ashes to their mush, to the dough. And the ash alkali activates chemical processes that actually increase the niacin value but decrease the tryptophan, making it chemically much more nutritious and safe, non-inflammatory food.
- So when we compare things that happened long ago of old diets and all that, we have to take into consideration exactly what they were doing to the food, like I think the ashes and the corn and the tortillas in Mexico you talked about. - Yeah. - Yeah, same idea. - But you can do it with wheat or any grain. - I was interested in the link that Dr. Peat made between hypoglycemia and lactic acid from a previous show. I've had some issues with hypoglycemia and relieved with diet changes,
but now I've been diagnosed with HCM and AFib that are exacerbated by lactic and buildup. Is there a link between hypoglycemia and cardiovascular disease? - Yeah, when your oxidative apparatus, when the mitochondria are damaged, usually by fat, but other toxins can do it, you tend to produce lactic acid instead of carbon dioxide, and that is many times less efficient than oxidizing the sugar. And so you're producing lactic acid and consuming sugar at a high rate, but not getting the energetic benefit from it. And to get the maximum energy,
you use sugar at an extremely high rate and just have trouble keeping your blood sugar steady. - Okay, Dr. Ray Peat, stay right there, sir, please, if you will. We're gonna take a little break here. These guys are on sale right now, 50% off, I think, for a few more days, all the Living Streams, 50, hello, 50%. Dr. Richard Ulrey, authority on minerals, talks about gut bacteria, making the vitamins, and absorbing the minerals, how it all works. - We need vitamins from our gut bacteria so we can absorb minerals,
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So check it out, any Sir Thrival link, oneradionetwork.com. I think we have two more days of sale on this product. Previously with Dr. Rulan Chu about her product called Pearlseum. So let's talk about the teeth first. Explain to me what's going on, because there's something magical when you dip your little toothbrush in water. Why do they look so sparkly and just, I don't know, something very energetically about the look of them. - Yeah, it's very, very magical. So like a group of scientists in France discovered that when you put pearl next to the bones
or skins or other connective tissues, and they find it stimulates new growth of the bones and skins and connective tissues, and also to make existing bones and the skins more healthy and stronger. So brush your teeth with the pearl, then your teeth will make your existing teeth stronger, and also it will filling up teeth with the pearlseum, and the pearl powder will stimulate the new bone growth and also make the existing teeth very strong. - It's really a great product. You'll love it. Take it internally or on your teeth, and you can click an order.
See the ad right there, Pearlseum, in a nice green container. Pearlseum on oneradionetwork.com. We're talking with Dr., yeah, and excuse me, 15% off right now, promo code OneRadio for Pearlseum. It's just real pearl. I think it's calcium carbonate if you break it down. Kind of think so. Real pearl that they break down without messing up the cellular matrix. So it's gonna go where it needs to go, calcium, and also a lot of other herbs, proteins, and other minerals in this product. So it's a good one.
Dr. Ray Peat is with us on the third Tuesday of the month, and we thank you for coming on, and people really like your work. raypeat.com, you can look at all of his articles, and also he has a great newsletter. You can sign up, and I think it's every other month, and we always put the link on the show page. You can just kind of click an order if you would like to get the newsletter from Dr. Ray Peat, and that's often fun. Doc, here's an interesting question. Athletes often have low pulses
and suboptimal thyroid function. I was a recreational athlete but did a run, a full marathon in my youth. Pulse was always around 60, even though my body temperature at dawn was like 97.6, and rises to 98 during the day. I breathe about five to six times per minute. So I'm wondering if despite adequate temperature, the pulse could be related to consuming fewer breaths per minute than the average person. - Yeah, endurance exercise can slow your metabolism by reducing the thyroid, and the tissue itself can become more efficient. People who live at very high altitude
have adapted their tissues so that they resist shifting over to making lactic acid. And probably some endurance athletes have a similar adaptation that simply makes their tissues more efficient, resisting forming the wasteful lactic acid. Coffee drinking does some similar things, simply increasing the efficiency of the tissue, making it able to produce more energy without going over into lactic acid production. - Wow, coffee, good old coffee. But haven't we often been told over the years that too much exercise or exercise produces lactic acid? That's why the muscles hurt and everything? - Yeah, at low altitude,
if a person is starting out with a thyroid problem, a deficient thyroid function, they are already producing too much lactic acid just at rest. And so the lower your thyroid function is, the lower the threshold is for going over into lactic acid production. And so when your thyroid is high, you're in effect living at a high altitude. People going to a high altitude, the T3 active thyroid hormone rises considerably. And that's part of the ability to do full amount of work without producing lactic acid. But both high altitude and good thyroid function
and certain types of chronic adaptation can produce that. - And to recap, when you see a TSH, what number, if you were kind of looking at it, that you would like to see? - .001. - Whoa, whoa, really? - It's okay if it's .1. - You're not talking about one, two, or three, you're talking about .00. - Yeah, a large population was surveyed to see how many thyroid cancers there were and what the TSH in the population was. The populations that had 0.4 and down, 0.4 was the highest in the group,
they were essentially free of thyroid cancer. - So, but I mean, these tests don't even go to decimals. The lowest they go is one, right? - Oh no, they're new tests that go out to three points. - Oh really? - Three decimal points. - You could ask for a test and say, "I wanna see the decimals on this baby." - Oh yeah, I think they, as a rule, are doing that now. - But even general than a TSH of two, three, or four, you're suggesting that folks--
- Yeah, I've never seen anyone who was free of symptoms who had a 2.0 or-- - Or higher. - Or higher, yeah, but very few people at 1.5 are really fully functioning. - And what are some of the symptoms of, say a two or a three TSH would be? - Some kind of inflammatory problem somewhere in the system. - Could be insomnia? - Oh sure, yeah. - Oh yeah, sure. So you don't wanna get one of those full-fledged little piggy thyroid desiccated and start slow and work up
and see if you can get rid of that, whatever symptoms you have, is in general what you recommend? - Yeah, good general nutrition where you're not getting too much phosphate but are getting at least 80 to 100 grams of protein per day. - 80 to 100 of protein? But milk gives you the phosphate. - Yeah, milk gives you the phosphate but in proportion to calcium and magnesium. - I see. - And so if you drink three quarts of milk, you're getting an adequate amount of protein just from the milk. - Dr. Peat, I've been diagnosed
with supraventricular tachycardia, pulse of 200 beats, wow, almost instantly, ablation recommended. I'm in my early 80s, just finished cervical cancer treatment, five weeks radiation, five doses of chemo. Examined by oncologist two months ago, received no visible signs of cancer. Can you give me some advice on what I can do to balance things out? - Checking vitamin D would be the very first thing because if your vitamin D is low, you're subject to the excitatory effects of phosphate. And checking the amount of calcium and magnesium in your diet along with the vitamin D,
those are the heart-stabilizing nutrients, most important one, and selenium from seafoods in particular. One good meal of seafood per week will provide the required selenium. And that lets your tissues form the thyroid hormone. Your T4 in circulation might be adequate, but without selenium, the individual tissues won't be able to produce the T3 that they need, for example, for the heart metabolism. And avoiding a salt-deficient diet goes right along with getting enough calcium. 40 years ago, the dogma was that high blood pressure went with high sodium intake, but a researcher named McCarron
looked at the diets more carefully and showed that a calcium deficiency was the problem, and that the people with hypertension were actually deficient in both calcium and sodium. - And deficient, yeah. Are the docs still doing that whole low-self thing? Is that still going around, I guess? - I keep hearing it occasionally. Not as bad as it used to be. - Here's a recent blood test from Trent indicates his estradiol is 15.1 pg/mL. What is the optimum estrogen blood level for a 70-year-old male, and do men need estrogen? Do you recommend nutrient prescription drugs
to block estrogen? - No, that's a very fine, low estrogen. Typically, aging men get more and more estrogen, but 15 pg/mL is good. - That's okay. Here's one for you. I've seen mixed studies about the damage caused by cooking food in a microwave oven, particularly the proteins becoming allergic. What does Dr. Peat think about microwave ovens? - It causes the same changes that boiling your meat does, and it has the virtue of not tending to scorch things on the outside like a baking oven would. So I think on average, the nutrients are safer by microwave,
but it just doesn't taste as good. - Yeah, so the nutrients are actually more with microwave than they are boiling, but not with cooking properly, though. - No. - No. Plus, there's a lot of EMFs that come out. I don't know if you've ever put one of those to the email or one of those RF meters on 10 feet from a microwave. - Yeah, the old microwave used to put out a huge field, but-- - Are they better now? - Yeah, they're safe about three or four feet away. - Ah, here's an email.
Numerous recent guests on Patrick's show have stated that it is microscopic parasites, potentially, that cause unhealthy calcification of the tissues, like toxoplasmosis, contributing to calcification in the brain. Are there any remedies Dr. Ray can recommend for eliminating these little tiny parasites, repairing the damage they can cause? - Just getting your immune system revved up, keeping your body temperature up around 98.6 in the daytime, and your oxidative metabolism going well. The immune system can take care of those. - So running around after, say, I do my show and I go outside and whatever,
and then just do my body temperature, in that case, it should be around 98.6 or so. That would be the ideal? - If you're active and walking around, your muscles provide the heat to keep you up there. - And then what about first thing in the morning, though? - Oh, it's okay to be cool during the night. - Lower, I mean, that makes sense, right. Dr. Ray Peat talks about red light, but what does he think about colors on the walls and all of these kinds of things, blue and green?
Do they provide any more happiness for us, colors on the walls? - Oh, sure. Bright lights are essential avoiding gloom, but colors make it more interesting, not just the brightness. - Dr. Ray, Peat is with us. We'll do a few more here before we let him go. Are there any good safe spices, writes an emailer. Safe spices. - Oh, yeah, they all have their toxic levels. - Do they? - Some of them are so tasty, like chili. Chili pepper has, the spice can burn you and cause serious damage and probably stomach cancer
if you eat the hot chilies. - Too many of them. - Too, in excess, but clove is a pretty safe spice. Cinnamon, pepper, black pepper. - Black pepper. Can you please ask Dr. Peat from Amy in San Diego about ingesting chlorella powder, spirulina powder, charcoal, diatomaceous earth, if no fillers, is it still a good way to? - No, I think all of them have their potential risks. - You don't like the chlorella, spirulina, none of those? - No, because occasionally they have been found to be contaminated with toxins.
- If they were clean, would you be okay with them? - Yeah, if somehow you could have each batch tested. - Good luck with that. Here's an email from Europe. In the past half year, I have started putting sugar in coffee and also greatly increased intake of freshly processed OJ. For me, it means, it seems to have increased dental cavities. Wow, a recent visit to the dentist resulted in a great disappointment. How do we find strength and confidence in adopting Dr. Peat's recommendation of not being afraid of sugar and fruit juices,
especially when everyone else is convinced that sugar destroys the teeth? - Well, it's good to rinse your mouth after every intake. - Because of the acidity on the, yeah. - Yeah. - And I think it would also have to do a lot with the other balances of the minerals, wouldn't it? - Oh yeah, the quality of your saliva varies according to your hormones. And some cavities start inside the teeth when you're under stress. They're called stress cavities because the tooth removes minerals under stress. - This is from Kristen. A desiccated thyroid for autoimmune thyroiditis.
Is bovine okay or does it want to be derived from pig? - No, both of them are good. - Both of them are good? - Mm-hmm. - Okay, so please ask Dr. Ray Peat if A2 milk is good. If it's a store-bought and has a natural protein. I like it warm at night and less tummy discomfort. They actually sell A2 milk. I saw it at the store, but I don't think it's, I've never seen one where it's antibiotic-free and stuff like that. - I tried that kind for two or three months. - Did you?
- And it was okay, but they didn't have it in 1%, only 2%, so I like the low-fat milk. - But I thought that's good for milk, right? - Yeah, I think 1% is okay. - Does Dr. Ray Peat have any suggestions for reversing lactic acidosis, juicing, baking soda, lower fat intake? - Yep, both of those. - All those? - Good thyroid function, vitamin D. - What does Dr. Ray Peat think of Shi-la-jit? - What was the word? - Shi-la-jit. Oh, that's a mineral from Siberia, I think. - Yeah, somewhere like that.
- Yeah, I don't know anything directly about it, just what I've read. - I think the Amazon man is here again. They just come any time, and my dog is barking a little bit, but it's time to go anyway. Well, Dr. Peat, what are you gonna do over the holidays? Anything special? - Nope, just keep working. - Keep working, yeah. Do you travel much anymore? Have you ever, when's the last time you've been down to Mexico? - Oh, years ago. - Uh-huh, you don't have any desire to go back and visit at all?
- Oh yeah, I'm ready to go anytime I please. - There's some really beautiful parts of Mexico, isn't there, really? - Oh yeah, yep. - Phew, man, that they don't have banditos. You just gotta be careful where you go these days. - Yeah. - Well, Dr. Ray Peat, thanks so much for being here. Merry Christmas, Happy New Year, and we will see you in January, and we'll have all the information on your website on our show page for you. - Okay, thank you. - Thank you, appreciate it, bye. - Bye.
- Dr. Ray Peat, Patrick Timpone, OneRadioNetwork.com. Please pass on these links to everyone that you care about. Who's out there, Doodle? Who is out there? Was there somebody at the door? Oh, it's probably just the Amazon man. They just come, anytime. The Amazon man, he just comes. All right. Well, kids, we'll see you tomorrow. I'm not sure what's going on tomorrow. It's just kind of up in the air. We may move Dr. Massey to tomorrow, and I don't know. So it's up in the air, but we will see you tomorrow at nine o'clock Central Time.
One Radio Network right here will be on video somehow, somewhere. Please pass on these links to everyone that you care about, and also, if you would like us on Facebook and stuff like that, that always helps spread the word about our show, please let us know about some guests that you would like to hear from. Email me, [email protected]. If you have questions about any of the products that we promote, same thing, [email protected]. So we'll see you tomorrow morning at nine o'clock, and it'll probably just be a surprise of who we'll have on.
Okay, I love you all very much, and no matter what people say, you're doing the best you can, you're doing fine, don't worry, just keep on going. And see you tomorrow, may the blessings be. (upbeat music) - Nothing is more expensive than bad information. Know the source, OneRadioNetwork.com. (upbeat music) (logo whooshes) [BLANK_AUDIO]